Matt Warshaw recorded this interview with Pauline Menczer, some of which was used in "Against the Tide," a Lisa Andersen profile that ran in the March 1996 issue of Live magazine. Menczer, the 1994 world champion, was 25.

Nowhere, really. I'm always traveling. When I'm home I pretty much live in a camper van and just cruise around. Most of my stuff is at my mom's house in Byron Bay, so I'll see her on the weekends then pack up go somewhere for the week.

You won your world title without a major sponsor.

So last year, when you were defending world champ, you had just one sponsor?

Well, Piping Hot and a couple small ones.

Yeah, of course. I looked and looked and finally got sick of looking.

After travel expenses and everything, no. Nothing. Maybe a couple thousand.

Seems like your arthritis is better this year. [At age 10, Menczer was diagnosed with rheumatoid arthritis.]

I don't know. Sometimes, but not really. It comes when it wants, how it wants. Sometimes it's so bad I can't surf, I can't even get out of bed. Mostly it's in my hips and neck. My neck will get really stiff and sore; in my hip it's sharp, like a knife. Really horrible pinching pain.

There were times that year when I couldn't walk straight; I walked with one hip out in front of the other. I couldn't even walk around to go shopping, and I had to have somebody help me get out of the bathtub. It was like that for almost three months. I went in and got cortisone shot, but it didn't do much. I had a friend who looked after me.

No, she's a trainer and a masseuse, and a friend. But I can't really afford to pay her, so she travels with me only now and again. When she's with me, and I'm getting the massages and so forth, I surf ten times better.

Is she at this event? [The US Open, Huntington Beach.]

No, and it showed. I've been stiff all week. I just got 9th.

Is it the kind of arthritis that gets worse as you get older?

Not for me, not yet anyway. But the older I get the more scared of it I am.


Lisa Andersen won the title last year, but you actually had more wins. You got five, she had three. [Menczer finished runner-up in the 1994 ratings to Andersen.]

Yeah, but that's just the way it goes. Lisa ripped last year, she always does.

She got so much attention and buildup, even before the season was over.

That's a little annoying, actually. Especially here in America, it's all Lisa. Reporters, when they talk to the rest of us, they barely know who we are. Women's surfing, as far as America goes, 

 Lisa Anderson. Nobody else really has an identity. I won the world title less than two years ago, and people here still don't know my name.

At the Op Pro last year, you got 2nd and Lisa won, and there was some kind of hassle between you two afterwards.

I was in a really foul mood because a lot of people came up to me when I got out of the water and told me I won. So I was a bit peeved. I mean, everyone goes through a stage where they get ripped-on. You know that phrase?

So I was doing an interview on TV and somebody asked how I felt, and I said I felt like I got ripped-off. Lisa heard about it and came up to talk to me, and I told her that I thought she was getting ripped-on. And I really do think that.

The other part is that I got second in the contest, and after taxes that ends up being about $500. For making the finals. I mean, that's a joke! And everyone said I should have won? And now I'm supposed to go onstage and be like all smiles?

Maybe a little more. Not much. The money is a joke. Kathy Newman [another Aussie pro] just quit the whole tour. She just ran out of money. Kathy's one of the top-ranked girls on tour, and she just had enough. You're spending more than you're making. When there's no money in it, and it's so much effort, it's just not that much fun after a while.

From having to cope with my disease, I've become a pretty strong person. Like, it takes a lot to knock me down.

She's moody. Very friendly one day, then the next she won't even say hello. I think she does it on purpose. She likes to let us know that she's different from everybody else.

What did you think when Lisa said that she wants to surf like a man?

I feel sad for her sometimes, because she has a real problem being a woman. She 

 a woman; she always will be. But she's always comparing herself to male surfers. She surfs like a strong woman, not like a man. And from there it's like she's afraid to even be seen talking with us, with the rest of the women. If a guy surfer comes along, and she's talking to us, she'll leave and go talk with him. Every time

Lisa also had that comment about women pros needing to be more "girly girl" for the tour to succeed.

It's like the ASP wanted something to hassle the women pros about. So they thought, Lets' get 'em for not wearing dresses and high heels, and not being feminine enough." Right? Then [Aussie pro] Kylie Webb wore this really high-cut bathing suit in a heat, and she got shit for it! Like, she was hoping to get more points for being sexy, doing it the way they wanted. And they slammed her! So it's a no-win situation. If we all wore high heels and dresses it wouldn't change a thing.

But the glam girls do seem to have it easier. Or get more attention.

I don't know. It's not great for the tour. The money is still just getting worse. I mean, Kim Mearig, Lisa Anderson, Wendy Botha, Pam Burridge—they're all really pretty, and where has that got us? Nowhere. Nothing's changed. The money never gets better.

It means a lot to sponsors. You being a case in point.

Yeah, that's totally true. Guys who aren't so good-looking can get by on personality. Women can't do that.

Of course. Why can't a company sell the image of a woman on the beach, happy, in the sun, doing what she wants? The lifestyle. Being at the beach. Having fun. Life isn't about being sexy all the time.

Why do you think women like Lisa buy into that?

I think it comes from hearing it again and again from the men. They've heard it so many times they start saying it, too.

Lisa is married to Renato Hickle, who is also the head judge on the world tour. How's that go over with the other competitors?

People aren't happy about it. Even if nothing crook is going on behind the scenes, it's still in everyone's head—the competitors, the press, everyone. You're always thinking about it when you surf against her.

It doesn't make the world tour organizers look very good.

No, I mean, come on. No other sport would allow that. It's ridiculous.

Does it affect your enthusiasm for the tour?

It does, yeah. But my enthusiasm being low isn't all 'cause of what's happening with Lisa. I've just lost confidence this year, partly in myself, partly in the system. At the moment, I'm just kind of over the whole thing. I don't have fun anymore. I don't know. The tour is so unorganized. Some events, we don't get told about them until just before they happen, and other events get canceled out from underneath us, and if you call bullshit on what's happening everyone starts calling you a complainer. So can't say what you think. On the other hand, you want to talk it up, you want everyone to get excited about pro surfing, and support it. So what do you do? Tell the truth or go along and hope it gets better? I don't know. I don't know the answer is to that one. But I've been in a pretty bad mood since this contest started. Honestly, right now I just need to get out of America and see how I really feel. Talk to anyone, any of the pros, boys or girls, and they'll say then hate this place.

Changing subjects, are gay women on tour still getting hassled one way or the other?

It's still there, yeah. But the thing is, it's starting to be brought ought on the guys as well. There's a lot of gay guy surfers too, except it's all hush-hush. With the girls, everybody's all, "Oh, guess who's doing this and that." It's really funny how in every sport it's way more of a women's issue than a men's issue.

Didn't you get in some little hassle a while back with Tim Baker [editor of 

Yeah, he came up to me a couple years ago and said, "What do you think of our magazine?" And I went, "I think it's the biggest piece of shit ever published, and I tell anybody who'll listen not to buy it." As far as women's surfing go, if you're 

 magazine, it's either who's fucking who, or Hey check out this chick's ass. That's it. Which reminds me . . . the year I won the world title, nobody, that whole season, ever called me up for an interview. Nothing. Not once. Then right after I won, finally someone called from one of the Aussie mags, and the only question was this: Why do you think guys like big tits?

Does all this affect how you feel about surfing in general?

No. All this stuff isn't about surfing. I love surfing. I don't much love the surf scene. There's a difference. I've always seen the difference.

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